For the past few weeks, I've been talking with theater artists about their struggles and thoughts, but I wanted to take a more active approach, so I spent the past few days on the phone leading up to my interview for today with an Artistic Director who recently made a very difficult decision.
Here's the interview:
ME: How are you doing?
THEM: I've been better.
ME: It's weird to do an interview like this one where--usually there's a reason we keep these anonymous, but lately, it's weird, because not having them be anonymous might benefit some of the people I'm talking to, but--
THEM: But you still want people to talk freely and it helps to know you're anonymous.
ME: Do you like staying anonymous?
THEM: I do. I like it for now.
ME: Okay, we'll keep it for now. Can you tell me about your week?
THEM: This was one for the books.
ME: In a bad way.
THEM: In a bad way, yeah.
ME: How long have you been the Artistic Director of your theater?
THEM: I took over [Name of Theater] three years ago.
ME: How long had the theater been around before that?
THEM: Seven years.
ME: So this the tenth anniversary of the theater?
THEM: Yes. We had--we had a lot of great things planned that have all gone up in smoke.
ME: And when did you start talking about closing the theater?
THEM: That was--I think everyone with a theater, when all of this started happening, thought that closure might be a possibility. We didn't--That wasn't my first thought. Then, as we started getting a sense of--This might really be a long haul. This might be a year. This might be longer than a year. That was when we had to look at the numbers and think about whether we could make this work.
ME: And you decided it couldn't?
THEM: We decided that--We wanted to try, um--I'm sorry.
ME: It's okay.
THEM: I haven't--I really haven't had a moment of--of letting it hit me that...
ME: I get it. Believe me.
THEM: But we looked at the numbers and the numbers didn't work. We're a small theater, and--we would have needed--I know you've talked about fiscal responsibility in all of this, and we are--We have been very careful with our finances, but rent is an issue. There are bills we have--It's like--If we could clear the slate and just keep bills and costs at bay until this is all over, then we could do it. But we can't do it. Rent is still due. The bills are still due.
ME: Do you think rent would be waived?
THEM: I don't think it's going to be waived. I think we're going to be in a place where we're not made to pay right now, but we have reason to believe that we'd then have to retroactively pay rent, and that--without income, that would be difficult. That was factored into the number we came up with that we were telling people about online.
ME: And that's the number that you would need to raise to keep the lights on, right?
THEM: Yes.
ME: I saw the number and it--it doesn't seem like that big of a number.
THEM: It's not, but--every theater right now--every theater where I am--where you are--there is a frantic, uh, hunt for donors. For money. Nobody has any. We don't, our donors don't--it's very scary. We put it out there that we were looking for, um, do you want me to say how much it was?
ME: You don't have to.
THEM: We put the number out there and looked into--raising that amount. Um, we raised some of it, and we're very grateful for that, but--We didn't hit the number we needed. The plan is to give back the money we did raise, and--and we made the announcement, which everybody already knew, that we'd need to close.
ME: And that was last Wednesday.
THEM: That was last Wednesday.
ME: Is it too late for a miracle? Like, if something or somebody were to come forward with the money--is it too late?
THEM: No, but we're not in the business of miracles. We have to be practical. We have to talk to our landlord about our lease. We have to--figure out how we're going to handle the remaining bills we do have--
ME: But if all that could get taken care of, you could keep going?
THEM: Yes, because we would basically freeze everything, and um--Look, our staff needs to work, but this is their work. So until the theater can come back, none of us can work, so we would have had to sit tight. It's not a big staff, but I'm very proud of all of them. They're committed to this theater.
ME: They didn't want to close though, right?
THEM: No, and neither did I, but they understood why--why it had to happen.
ME: How has the community been responding?
THEM: They've been reaching out--a lot of people are upset. A lot of people want to help and have, um, helped, but...I can't take money from people on unemployment--or even ask for it. I can't take money from people who might really need it down the line or who are worried for their own lives and what's going to happen. We weren't supported by big companies or big sponsors. We kept things going with small donations, and those people are being hit really hard.
ME: So everybody is just heartbroken and you're not even that far from reaching the goal you set?
THEM: I would say we're far enough away and--and it's not going to get easier to raise money.
ME: What about help from the government? I almost laugh as I'm saying that, but--
THEM: Yeah, uh--(Laughs.)--We are...I'll just say it. We are in the shadow of a much bigger theater that is also in tough shape. We love them. They're great. But it's--it looks as though they're going to--to need the majority of the support that this--that people have to give. We don't see ourselves being able to fundraise alongside them, and we don't want to--to be in a place where we have to compete, because--it's not something we want to do. We also can't. Looking at their devo department and looking at ours--it's not going to work for us.
ME: How are you doing personally with all this?
THEM: I. I feel like I failed. I know this was out of my control, but it still happened on my watch. This is a theater people love and care about and it took me a long time to get the respect of the staff and the audience, even though they were very welcoming to me when I got here, but I feel like I got that respect, and now the theater is closing. It's hard not to take that personally.
ME: So--I have news for you.
THEM: Is this where you tell me I threw a chair at someone?
ME: No. (Laughs.) It's good news, actually.
THEM: I would love some good news.
ME: Well, our mutual friend [Name] reached out to me, as you know--
THEM: Yes.
ME: [They] are very upset about all this, and they wanted to see if I could help out with what they thought fundraising could look like.
THEM: Yes.
ME: Now, I'm lucky, because my theater is frozen right now, and we're able to be frozen, because we're even smaller than you, and we just--we're lucky. We got lucky.
THEM: Uh huh.
ME: So because I've been lucky enough to be lucky, I feel like I should try to do what I can to spread the luck, and I know a few people in your area who I thought could assist me. One of them is [Name]. who's part of the business owners association in your area, and I asked [them] if they could help me out, because some of them are hurting, definitely, but some are doing better than you might think.
THEM: Okay.
ME: One of the members of the association, for example, happens to be pretty high up in the group that owns the building you're in, and [Name] was able to talk to them and it turns out they're very nice people.
THEM: They've been good to us in the past.
ME: Have you talked to them about the rent situation?
THEM: We talked to the property manager and [they] were the ones who suggested that we'd need to pay retroactively even if rent was waived, which--it didn't seem like it would be.
ME: Well, with all due respect to the property manager, I pretty much went above their head.
THEM: (Laughs.) Okay.
ME: Or my friend did. Thank you [Name]. I'll put their name in later if they want it out there. They might not want to. But basically, the group that owns the building is waiving your rent until you're able to open again.
THEM: Are you joking?
ME: No, I'm not.
THEM: I don't know what to say to that.
ME: Wait, there's more. I've been very Oprah this week. I got a lot done now that I can't do anything else.
THEM: What did you do?
ME: Somebody told me that one of your actors lives in Los Angeles now?
THEM: [Name] does.
ME: [They] love you.
THEM: We love [them].
ME: But did you know their family is loaded?
THEM: I did not know that.
ME: You're going to make me your development person when all this is over.
THEM: Like I said, we haven't been able to ask--
ME: It's okay. That's why I'm here. They heard about the fundraiser from our mutual friend and they wanted to let you know that not only are they going to come up with the rest of the money you need, but they're going to double it.
(Silence.)
You there?
THEM: I--That's--
ME: You okay with staying open, because I think you're going to have to now.
THEM: I don't know what to say.
ME: Please tell me you're on the up and up, because otherwise this interview is not going to have the feel-good mood I'm looking for.
THEM: No, we're--we're coming back.
ME: You can come back now?
THEM: With all that in place--
ME: And--Wait!--I forgot. My friend--in the business association--[they're] going to work with you to get you back on your feet. They'll basically be like a mentor from a business standpoint. They're going to do it for free. They'll donate his time. So if you need extra help, they'll be there.
THEM: Thank you so much.
ME: You gonna call your staff?
THEM: As soon as I get off the phone with you.
ME: [Name] is going to call you too, but they've got a check for you.
THEM: What does their family do?
ME: I can't say that in the interview, but I'll text it to you. It's nothing bad.
THEM: I was gonna say--are they in the mob?
ME: Would you care?
THEM: No, I wouldn't.
ME: (Laughs.) Thank you giving me a project to work on these last few days.
THEM: Kevin, thank you. We all appreciate it. I can't believe this.
ME: Don't throw any chairs.
THEM: (Laughs.) I sold all our chairs. I'd have to buy one first.
ME: I'll send you one. That'll be my donation. The Kevin Broccoli Throwing Chair.
THEM: I'll be the first one to throw it.
Them is an Artistic Director.
THEM: I've been better.
ME: It's weird to do an interview like this one where--usually there's a reason we keep these anonymous, but lately, it's weird, because not having them be anonymous might benefit some of the people I'm talking to, but--
THEM: But you still want people to talk freely and it helps to know you're anonymous.
ME: Do you like staying anonymous?
THEM: I do. I like it for now.
ME: Okay, we'll keep it for now. Can you tell me about your week?
THEM: This was one for the books.
ME: In a bad way.
THEM: In a bad way, yeah.
ME: How long have you been the Artistic Director of your theater?
THEM: I took over [Name of Theater] three years ago.
ME: How long had the theater been around before that?
THEM: Seven years.
ME: So this the tenth anniversary of the theater?
THEM: Yes. We had--we had a lot of great things planned that have all gone up in smoke.
ME: And when did you start talking about closing the theater?
THEM: That was--I think everyone with a theater, when all of this started happening, thought that closure might be a possibility. We didn't--That wasn't my first thought. Then, as we started getting a sense of--This might really be a long haul. This might be a year. This might be longer than a year. That was when we had to look at the numbers and think about whether we could make this work.
ME: And you decided it couldn't?
THEM: We decided that--We wanted to try, um--I'm sorry.
ME: It's okay.
THEM: I haven't--I really haven't had a moment of--of letting it hit me that...
ME: I get it. Believe me.
THEM: But we looked at the numbers and the numbers didn't work. We're a small theater, and--we would have needed--I know you've talked about fiscal responsibility in all of this, and we are--We have been very careful with our finances, but rent is an issue. There are bills we have--It's like--If we could clear the slate and just keep bills and costs at bay until this is all over, then we could do it. But we can't do it. Rent is still due. The bills are still due.
ME: Do you think rent would be waived?
THEM: I don't think it's going to be waived. I think we're going to be in a place where we're not made to pay right now, but we have reason to believe that we'd then have to retroactively pay rent, and that--without income, that would be difficult. That was factored into the number we came up with that we were telling people about online.
ME: And that's the number that you would need to raise to keep the lights on, right?
THEM: Yes.
ME: I saw the number and it--it doesn't seem like that big of a number.
THEM: It's not, but--every theater right now--every theater where I am--where you are--there is a frantic, uh, hunt for donors. For money. Nobody has any. We don't, our donors don't--it's very scary. We put it out there that we were looking for, um, do you want me to say how much it was?
ME: You don't have to.
THEM: We put the number out there and looked into--raising that amount. Um, we raised some of it, and we're very grateful for that, but--We didn't hit the number we needed. The plan is to give back the money we did raise, and--and we made the announcement, which everybody already knew, that we'd need to close.
ME: And that was last Wednesday.
THEM: That was last Wednesday.
ME: Is it too late for a miracle? Like, if something or somebody were to come forward with the money--is it too late?
THEM: No, but we're not in the business of miracles. We have to be practical. We have to talk to our landlord about our lease. We have to--figure out how we're going to handle the remaining bills we do have--
ME: But if all that could get taken care of, you could keep going?
THEM: Yes, because we would basically freeze everything, and um--Look, our staff needs to work, but this is their work. So until the theater can come back, none of us can work, so we would have had to sit tight. It's not a big staff, but I'm very proud of all of them. They're committed to this theater.
ME: They didn't want to close though, right?
THEM: No, and neither did I, but they understood why--why it had to happen.
ME: How has the community been responding?
THEM: They've been reaching out--a lot of people are upset. A lot of people want to help and have, um, helped, but...I can't take money from people on unemployment--or even ask for it. I can't take money from people who might really need it down the line or who are worried for their own lives and what's going to happen. We weren't supported by big companies or big sponsors. We kept things going with small donations, and those people are being hit really hard.
ME: So everybody is just heartbroken and you're not even that far from reaching the goal you set?
THEM: I would say we're far enough away and--and it's not going to get easier to raise money.
ME: What about help from the government? I almost laugh as I'm saying that, but--
THEM: Yeah, uh--(Laughs.)--We are...I'll just say it. We are in the shadow of a much bigger theater that is also in tough shape. We love them. They're great. But it's--it looks as though they're going to--to need the majority of the support that this--that people have to give. We don't see ourselves being able to fundraise alongside them, and we don't want to--to be in a place where we have to compete, because--it's not something we want to do. We also can't. Looking at their devo department and looking at ours--it's not going to work for us.
ME: How are you doing personally with all this?
THEM: I. I feel like I failed. I know this was out of my control, but it still happened on my watch. This is a theater people love and care about and it took me a long time to get the respect of the staff and the audience, even though they were very welcoming to me when I got here, but I feel like I got that respect, and now the theater is closing. It's hard not to take that personally.
ME: So--I have news for you.
THEM: Is this where you tell me I threw a chair at someone?
ME: No. (Laughs.) It's good news, actually.
THEM: I would love some good news.
ME: Well, our mutual friend [Name] reached out to me, as you know--
THEM: Yes.
ME: [They] are very upset about all this, and they wanted to see if I could help out with what they thought fundraising could look like.
THEM: Yes.
ME: Now, I'm lucky, because my theater is frozen right now, and we're able to be frozen, because we're even smaller than you, and we just--we're lucky. We got lucky.
THEM: Uh huh.
ME: So because I've been lucky enough to be lucky, I feel like I should try to do what I can to spread the luck, and I know a few people in your area who I thought could assist me. One of them is [Name]. who's part of the business owners association in your area, and I asked [them] if they could help me out, because some of them are hurting, definitely, but some are doing better than you might think.
THEM: Okay.
ME: One of the members of the association, for example, happens to be pretty high up in the group that owns the building you're in, and [Name] was able to talk to them and it turns out they're very nice people.
THEM: They've been good to us in the past.
ME: Have you talked to them about the rent situation?
THEM: We talked to the property manager and [they] were the ones who suggested that we'd need to pay retroactively even if rent was waived, which--it didn't seem like it would be.
ME: Well, with all due respect to the property manager, I pretty much went above their head.
THEM: (Laughs.) Okay.
ME: Or my friend did. Thank you [Name]. I'll put their name in later if they want it out there. They might not want to. But basically, the group that owns the building is waiving your rent until you're able to open again.
THEM: Are you joking?
ME: No, I'm not.
THEM: I don't know what to say to that.
ME: Wait, there's more. I've been very Oprah this week. I got a lot done now that I can't do anything else.
THEM: What did you do?
ME: Somebody told me that one of your actors lives in Los Angeles now?
THEM: [Name] does.
ME: [They] love you.
THEM: We love [them].
ME: But did you know their family is loaded?
THEM: I did not know that.
ME: You're going to make me your development person when all this is over.
THEM: Like I said, we haven't been able to ask--
ME: It's okay. That's why I'm here. They heard about the fundraiser from our mutual friend and they wanted to let you know that not only are they going to come up with the rest of the money you need, but they're going to double it.
(Silence.)
You there?
THEM: I--That's--
ME: You okay with staying open, because I think you're going to have to now.
THEM: I don't know what to say.
ME: Please tell me you're on the up and up, because otherwise this interview is not going to have the feel-good mood I'm looking for.
THEM: No, we're--we're coming back.
ME: You can come back now?
THEM: With all that in place--
ME: And--Wait!--I forgot. My friend--in the business association--[they're] going to work with you to get you back on your feet. They'll basically be like a mentor from a business standpoint. They're going to do it for free. They'll donate his time. So if you need extra help, they'll be there.
THEM: Thank you so much.
ME: You gonna call your staff?
THEM: As soon as I get off the phone with you.
ME: [Name] is going to call you too, but they've got a check for you.
THEM: What does their family do?
ME: I can't say that in the interview, but I'll text it to you. It's nothing bad.
THEM: I was gonna say--are they in the mob?
ME: Would you care?
THEM: No, I wouldn't.
ME: (Laughs.) Thank you giving me a project to work on these last few days.
THEM: Kevin, thank you. We all appreciate it. I can't believe this.
ME: Don't throw any chairs.
THEM: (Laughs.) I sold all our chairs. I'd have to buy one first.
ME: I'll send you one. That'll be my donation. The Kevin Broccoli Throwing Chair.
THEM: I'll be the first one to throw it.
Them is an Artistic Director.
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