Before we begin, make sure you're all caught up by reading these in order--
This week is a big one.
I was turned onto this story by one of its main player's relatives, but I had a hard time getting that person to speak with me.
Until now.
Here's the interview:
ME: We actually sort of know each other.
LUCY: Sort of. (Laughs.) I hope they don't go looking through your Facebook to find me.
ME: What made you hesitant to speak to me?
LUCY: I don't like dragging up the past too much.
LUCY: I don't like dragging up the past too much.
ME: Were any of the things you read hurtful?
LUCY: No. It's another life. It's another--We're so far past all that.
LUCY: No. It's another life. It's another--We're so far past all that.
ME: But you were the one who was closest to Charlie.
LUCY: I don't know about all that. He wasn't that close to anybody, really.
ME: Even someone he was involved with romantically?
LUCY: He was involved with a few people romantically.
LUCY: He was involved with a few people romantically.
ME: Did you two have an open relationship?
LUCY: We never made any names for what we had. We just went together. That was all. He could do this thing. I'd do mine.
LUCY: We never made any names for what we had. We just went together. That was all. He could do this thing. I'd do mine.
ME: Did you read what the suggestion was about him and Pigpen?
LUCY: I did.
LUCY: I did.
ME: What did you think about that?
LUCY: I think it was true.
LUCY: I think it was true.
ME: Why do you say that?
LUCY: Because I know it was true.
LUCY: Because I know it was true.
ME: How did you know that?
LUCY: Well. We hung together. Once. Me, Charlie, and Pigpen.
ME: The three of you?
LUCY: Yes.
LUCY: Yes.
ME: How did that happen?
LUCY: We were all hanging out after rehearsal one night, and we got drunk, and that was it. Happened in the theater.
LUCY: We were all hanging out after rehearsal one night, and we got drunk, and that was it. Happened in the theater.
ME: In the theater?
LUCY: (Laughs.) Right onstage. We were all a little adventurous then, that was all.
LUCY: (Laughs.) Right onstage. We were all a little adventurous then, that was all.
ME: But what about that made you think Charlie was interested in Pigpen?
LUCY: The two of them spent more time on each other than they did on me. That's how.
LUCY: The two of them spent more time on each other than they did on me. That's how.
ME: For someone who didn't want to drag up the past, you're not shy about this stuff.
LUCY: (Laughs.) My daughter's going to kill me, but. Oh well.
ME: Do you remember the night of the fight?
LUCY: Oh yes.
LUCY: Oh yes.
ME: You were right in the thick of it.
LUCY: Yes I was, unfortunately.
ME: What do you remember about it?
LUCY: I remember Pigpen showed up looking for trouble, and he got it.
LUCY: I remember Pigpen showed up looking for trouble, and he got it.
ME: You got into it with Woodstock.
LUCY: I did.
ME: She said she hit you accidentally and then Charlie came running at me.
LUCY: That what she said? Accidentally?
ME: Yes.
ME: Yes.
LUCY: Okay. Not how I remember it, but okay.
ME: She hit you intentionally?
LUCY: That's how I recall it.
LUCY: That's how I recall it.
ME: Why would she do that?
LUCY: Because I had told her earlier she was getting kicked out of the theater.
LUCY: Because I had told her earlier she was getting kicked out of the theater.
ME: Kicked out like Pigpen was?
LUCY: Yes.
LUCY: Yes.
ME: Why?
LUCY: Her, Pigpen, and--Patty, all of them--They were all going to go off and start their own theater, and I found out about it. I went into the dressing room before the show, and before we did the show--Charlie didn't want me to, because he wanted to keep it secret until we were ready to do what we had to do, but I don't go like that. I was going to put them on notice. I went into the dressing room and I got myself up on a chair, because I was too much back then, had to be that way, and and I get up on the chair, and I tell them all I knew what they were planning and I hope they had a good show, because it was going to be their last one at the theater. They were done after that. All of them. One or two were loyal. The rest were out. That's why I had a target on my back in that fight.
LUCY: Her, Pigpen, and--Patty, all of them--They were all going to go off and start their own theater, and I found out about it. I went into the dressing room before the show, and before we did the show--Charlie didn't want me to, because he wanted to keep it secret until we were ready to do what we had to do, but I don't go like that. I was going to put them on notice. I went into the dressing room and I got myself up on a chair, because I was too much back then, had to be that way, and and I get up on the chair, and I tell them all I knew what they were planning and I hope they had a good show, because it was going to be their last one at the theater. They were done after that. All of them. One or two were loyal. The rest were out. That's why I had a target on my back in that fight.
ME: Nobody told me about that.
LUCY: I'm not surprised they didn't. They all had their heads down, because they got found out.
ME: But, okay, forgive me, but--Was it your place to tell them they were getting kicked out?
LUCY: It was my company.
ME: It sounded like Charlie's company.
LUCY: Charlie couldn't run a lemonade stand. That was all me.
ME: So you were the brains behind-the-scenes?
LUCY: And in front. Everybody knew that. All over. I was all over.
ME: Was Charlie okay with that?
LUCY: He had to be. What choice did he have? He didn't have a choice.
LUCY: He had to be. What choice did he have? He didn't have a choice.
ME: Then why didn't you keep running things after he left?
LUCY: We didn't have a place to do anything. Neither did those other jerks. That's why the whole thing stopped. The theater, where we were.
LUCY: We didn't have a place to do anything. Neither did those other jerks. That's why the whole thing stopped. The theater, where we were.
ME: Did you love Charlie?
LUCY: I loved a lot of people back then.
LUCY: I loved a lot of people back then.
ME: But some of them must have been the same people that were going to go off with Pigpen?
LUCY: That's why it hurt. That's why I was so mad.
ME: How did you find out that's what they were planning?
LUCY: You find out everything when it's a small town. You can't hide s___.
LUCY: You find out everything when it's a small town. You can't hide s___.
ME: But you must have heard it from somebody.
LUCY: I don't want to say who I heard it from, but I heard it.
ME: Still don't want to say after all these years?
LUCY: Just somebody asks me to keep something secret, I keep it secret.
LUCY: Just somebody asks me to keep something secret, I keep it secret.
ME: What did you think about what was insinuated about you and Sally and--
LUCY: Them trying to say Sally's husband knocked me up?
ME: Yes.
ME: Yes.
LUCY: Can I light up a cigarette real quick?
ME: Sure.
ME: Sure.
(A few minutes later.)
LUCY: Sally's husband didn't get me pregnant, but we hung out.
ME: So who got you pregnant?
LUCY: That's my business.
LUCY: That's my business.
ME: Do you know who it is?
LUCY: Yes, I do.
LUCY: Yes, I do.
ME: Was Charlie stealing money from the theater?
LUCY: With me keeping an eye on everything? No.
LUCY: With me keeping an eye on everything? No.
ME: Was money ever missing?
LUCY: All the time. Maybe that group that was going to run off took it. I don't know.
LUCY: All the time. Maybe that group that was going to run off took it. I don't know.
ME: But how could they? Weren't you in charge?
LUCY: They could have been raiding the box office, but it wasn't Charlie. Charlie wore the same pair of ripped jeans for weeks on end. He wasn't stealing any money.
LUCY: They could have been raiding the box office, but it wasn't Charlie. Charlie wore the same pair of ripped jeans for weeks on end. He wasn't stealing any money.
ME: Do you know where he is now?
LUCY: No, but it seems like you might from what I read.
LUCY: No, but it seems like you might from what I read.
ME: Franklin had an idea about where he was.
LUCY: You going to talk to him?
ME: I'm going to try.
ME: I'm going to try.
LUCY: Tell him I said 'Hi.'
ME: When was the last time you talked?
LUCY: Not since he left.
LUCY: Not since he left.
ME: What did you think about being left in that way?
LUCY: In what way?
ME: It sounded like he just took off.
LUCY: In what way?
ME: It sounded like he just took off.
LUCY: I had no use for him then. We didn't have a theater anymore. He had a nice p___er, but I found others. It wasn't any skin off my back.
ME: Do you still talk to any of those people?
LUCY: From back then? No.
LUCY: From back then? No.
ME: Is there anything that's come up in previous interviews that you take issue with?
LUCY: A lot of lying, but I don't hold that against anybody. Everybody has their own version of things. That's all it is.
LUCY: A lot of lying, but I don't hold that against anybody. Everybody has their own version of things. That's all it is.
ME: Do you agree with Franklin's assertion that Charlie was dangerous?
LUCY: He was angry. He had a bad temper. His dad used to beat him real bad when he was a kid. He never got over that.
ME: He told you that his father beat him?
LUCY: And I saw the scars on him. I asked him where he got them from and he told me. Only time I saw him get choked up in all the time I knew him.
LUCY: And I saw the scars on him. I asked him where he got them from and he told me. Only time I saw him get choked up in all the time I knew him.
ME: Did you do any theater after all this?
LUCY: Wasn't anywhere to do it. Pretty soon, I had a kid to think about.
LUCY: Wasn't anywhere to do it. Pretty soon, I had a kid to think about.
ME: Would you be willing to talk with everyone--like a reunion? If I could get everybody together?
LUCY: I don't think so.
ME: Why not?
LUCY: We can't get together now in person anyhow.
LUCY: We can't get together now in person anyhow.
ME: That might be for the best. I was thinking something digital.
LUCY: On the computer?
ME: Yes.
ME: Yes.
LUCY: I might do something like that. As long as we're not in the same room, because if some of those f___ers go off, I'm not just going to sit there and let them.
ME: Who do you think would go off?
LUCY: Sally could never keep her mouth shut. Marcie either.
LUCY: Sally could never keep her mouth shut. Marcie either.
ME: Yeah, I learned that the hard way.
LUCY: Marcie needs to worry more about getting caught selling drugs than she does about these interviews.
ME: You're saying she sells drugs.
LUCY: She didn't get a new car working at Costco, now did she?
ME: She's not going to like that.
LUCY: Put that in the interview. I'll go on record with that. She sells drugs. Sally and her husband, they're into the--What did that guy just get caught with? The Reverend?
ME: Oh Falwell?
LUCY: Put that in the interview. I'll go on record with that. She sells drugs. Sally and her husband, they're into the--What did that guy just get caught with? The Reverend?
ME: Oh Falwell?
LUCY: Yeah.
ME: He and his wife? They--Well, she would sleep with a man and he would watch.
LUCY: That's what Sally and her husband do. That's why I didn't get pregnant by him, I bet. A man's got to get you pregnant. He's not much of a man. Charlie had a better p____er than he did.
ME: What about Pigpen?
LUCY: His wasn't much better.
LUCY: His wasn't much better.
ME: I mean in terms of just him--
LUCY: They're all bad people, Kevin. That's what I'm trying to say. Pigpen beat up every woman he was ever with because he can't handle the fact that he's gay and he should just be gay. Schroeder, he was a drunk. Linus was a f____ing up-your-a___ brownnoser. Same with Snoopy. Patty, she was a crazy b____. That's all she was. She got caught with a fifteen-year-old, you know.
ME: Boy or girl?
LUCY: Girl. Had her living at her house. Oh yeah.
LUCY: Girl. Had her living at her house. Oh yeah.
ME: If you haven't kept in touch--
LUCY: You don't need to keep in touch. You hear all this. Schroeder has so many DUI's, I don't know how he's not in jail.
ME: And what about you?
LUCY: What about me?
ME: What was your dirty little secret?
LUCY: I was an open book. Always was like that.
LUCY: What about me?
ME: What was your dirty little secret?
LUCY: I was an open book. Always was like that.
(A moment.)
LUCY: You got something you want to say to me?
ME: Do you want me to say it or do you want to say it?
LUCY: You say whatever you want.
ME: Do you want me to say it or do you want to say it?
LUCY: You say whatever you want.
ME: I heard--
LUCY: Uh huh.
ME: I've heard from a couple of people that you knew about that other group forming from Pigpen.
LUCY: Why would I hear it from him?
ME: Because you thought you were going to start it with him.
ME: Because you thought you were going to start it with him.
LUCY: That's not true.
ME: Did he break it off with you when he and Woodstock started dating?
LUCY: They weren't dating. _____ing _____ isn't dating, as far as I know.
LUCY: They weren't dating. _____ing _____ isn't dating, as far as I know.
ME: Well--
LUCY: Did she tell you he beat the shit out of her in the parking lot at that cast party? That's why Charlie and I--That's why we went after him. In the driveway. With everybody watching. Nobody else did anything. He tried hitting on her, and I was on him so fast, and Charlie backed me up. Nobody else did a damn thing.
ME: But were you planning to start a theater with him?
LUCY: Pigpen was--He told me 'One day I'm going to have my own theater.' That's back when we were getting along. I didn't talk to him after we fought at that cast party.
LUCY: Pigpen was--He told me 'One day I'm going to have my own theater.' That's back when we were getting along. I didn't talk to him after we fought at that cast party.
ME: But after that he told you he didn't want you starting the new theater with him?
LUCY: There was no talk about starting a new theater. Not with me. That was all them.
LUCY: There was no talk about starting a new theater. Not with me. That was all them.
ME: Were you going to leave Charlie? Because Pigpen said you could run it and Charlie wouldn't let you run anything?
LUCY: I was running it.
LUCY: I was running it.
ME: But you weren't getting credit.
LUCY: I got credit. Everybody knew what I was doing.
ME: Like everybody knew you were going to break off and start your own theater with Pigpen? And he was going to be the lead actor and you were going to be Artistic Director?
LUCY: I never asked to be Artistic Director of anything. We never even had that.
LUCY: I never asked to be Artistic Director of anything. We never even had that.
ME: Did you go to Charlie and tell him what the others were doing so you could get ahead of the situation because if he found out--
LUCY: If he found out, he would have blown my head off. I knew that. That's why I would never have started something else. You didn't cross Charlie like that. They were all crazy for trying.
ME: Did you have something on him?
LUCY: On who?
ME: Charlie.
ME: Charlie.
LUCY: I'm done talking about this.
ME: Is that how you knew he wouldn't come after you if you left?
LUCY: I'm all done, Kevin. I said what I had to say.
LUCY: I'm all done, Kevin. I said what I had to say.
ME: Pigpen showed up the night of the brawl to tell him about the new theater and to tell him you were involved. He wasn't there to fight with Charlie. He was there to out you, because Woodstock called him and told him that you made a big speech to the whole dressing room trying to cover your ass.
LUCY: That's not true.
ME: She knew that he had asked you to join him because they were sleeping together, but nobody else did, and he told her not to say anything, because he still cared about you and didn't want Charlie to retaliate against you, especially if you had nowhere else to go.
LUCY: That's not true. You're making up stories.
ME: What was the new theater going to be called?
LUCY: Ask Pigpen. It was going to be his.
ME: What did you know about Charlie?
LUCY: Nothing everybody else didn't know.
ME: Were you blackmailing him? Is that how you got all those roles?
LUCY: F___ you.
That was the end of the interview.
Comments
Post a Comment